Steam vs Epic Games

GhostTrick said:
The deal with Epic didn't make Shenmue 3 happen. The deal happened barely a few weeks ago. You really believe "this made Shenmue III" ?
No, all it made is a safer investment for Deep Silver who recouped part of the costs earlier.
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By the by the Unreal Engine made Shenmue 3 and Epic have showcased the product themselves so it's not a massive stretch that they'd work together.

Anyway do we know if it is a cash grab for Deep Silver? And even if was, as I said earlier, without profit no one was gonna get involved. It's not a passion project for Deep Silver and the game was pretty much being made out of Yu's garage when it launched.

So yes, in a roundabout way, i believe this deal has in fact helped Shenmue 3 to happen.
 
chidoribh said:
Its a very bad move. I feel publishers of Shenmue 3 is really trying their best to ruin sales and pissing off PC gamers on purpose with their exclusive bulls***
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You hit the nail on the head and I don't know why more people aren't talking about this. Deep Silver clearly retrieved the Publishing Rights so that they could deliberately ruin sales and piss off the "PC Gamers" on purpose. We all need to acknowledge @chidoribh's strong points here.
 
NeoShredder said:
By the by the Unreal Engine made Shenmue 3 and Epic have showcased the product themselves so it's not a massive stretch that they'd work together.

Anyway do we know if it is a cash grab for Deep Silver? And even if was, as I said earlier, without profit no one was gonna get involved. It's not a passion project for Deep Silver and the game was pretty much being made out of Yu's garage when it launched.

So yes, in a roundabout way, i believe this deal has in fact helped Shenmue 3 to happen.
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I mentioned this in another thread, but it's very likely that Epic completely waived the development's team UE fees in exchange for Epic Store exclusivity. It would be very difficult to pass that offer up.
 
Ceej said:
You hit the nail on the head and I don't know why more people aren't talking about this. Deep Silver clearly retrieved the Publishing Rights so that they could deliberately ruin sales and piss off the "PC Gamers" on purpose. We all need to acknowledge @chidoribh's strong points here.
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I really would like to understand your viewpoint. Why would Deepsilver deliberately want to ruin PC games sales? Have they done things like this in the past?
 
Hmm, I know and acknowledge that it doesn't work out like this, but Epic Games has 80 million users?

So, if even .5% of their userbase purchases this game (aside from the current backers), we will have 400,000 sales of the game?

Thus, would the game REALLY see that large amount of sales, even on Steam? People associated with it were happy to hit the 1 million mark and we know that we'll probably have 75% of the sales for this game, on the PS4, thus will it truly matter for the series future, if the game was moved over the Epic Games?

Again, I know it isn't that simple, but from a strictly number viewpoint (if the 80 million figure is correct), I don't see how this will hurt the franchise going forward, provided the sales actually turn out that way (and I know they probably won't, but surely DS and co. are better at predictions that you or I).
 
I imagine Epic will begin delivering these missing features at some point. They need to.
 
Developers aren't picking Epic. They are being paid to go to Epic. I would imagine that the money Epic is giving them for exclusivity outweighs lost sales on the platform. That's part of the problem, is that developers/publishers are choosing Epic's money over consumer's money.

On paper, Epics revenue distribution is awesome. However, the store is lacking, the launcher is lacking and thus there's no real reason for me as a consumer to choose it over Steam, GOG, Origin, Uplay, GMG or whatever else.

Another problem is choice being taken away. For a lot of games, I have the choice to buy where I want. Epic is now aggressively removing that choice. I don't want the Epic launcher. That is my decision. For Ys Net to force me against my own decision is pretty messed up.
 
mjqjazzbar said:
I imagine Epic will begin delivering these missing features at some point. They need to.
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They cant even go by their own road map to deliver features they promised. They havent reached their April or May goals. They dont even have a shopping cart. It would be understandable if they didnt have some extremely hi-tech features day one but these are basic as fuck common ass features that should have been there day one. If you launch a store in 2019, you need to launch it with 2019 standards. You cant just say, they are new at this when they have so many other stores to use as an example for the basis of their store.

Thomasina said:
Developers aren't picking Epic. They are being paid to go to Epic. I would imagine that the money Epic is giving them for exclusivity outweighs lost sales on the platform. That's part of the problem, is that developers/publishers are choosing Epic's money over consumer's money.

On paper, Epics revenue distribution is awesome. However, the store is lacking, the launcher is lacking and thus there's no real reason for me as a consumer to choose it over Steam, GOG, Origin, Uplay, GMG or whatever else.

Another problem is choice being taken away. For a lot of games, I have the choice to buy where I want. Epic is now aggressively removing that choice. I don't want the Epic launcher. That is my decision. For Ys Net to force me against my own decision is pretty messed up.
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Yeah it is messed up. Its anti competitive. Buying exclusivity for something that has already received funding is twice ad fucked, since it wont help the game in any way.

Its just to arbitrarily lock the game to one platform cause reasons. Sure Deep Silver is getting money up front and it helps them make money even if the game flops but that might not make its way back to YSNet, and it surely doesnt benefit consumers in any way. It actively harms them.

I imagine anyone who backed the physical version on a disc are mightily upset now its just a box with a code in it.
 
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Thomasina said:
Developers aren't picking Epic. They are being paid to go to Epic. I would imagine that the money Epic is giving them for exclusivity outweighs lost sales on the platform. That's part of the problem, is that developers/publishers are choosing Epic's money over consumer's money.

On paper, Epics revenue distribution is awesome. However, the store is lacking, the launcher is lacking and thus there's no real reason for me as a consumer to choose it over Steam, GOG, Origin, Uplay, GMG or whatever else.

Another problem is choice being taken away. For a lot of games, I have the choice to buy where I want. Epic is now aggressively removing that choice. I don't want the Epic launcher. That is my decision. For Ys Net to force me against my own decision is pretty messed up.
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It's not anti consumer it's good business. You can't expect anyone to turn down millions and a bigger slice of the pie. Businesses are here to make money thats the bottom line. Why do you think it's been almost 20 years since Shenmue 3? Developers have to believe there is money to be made. MONEY MONEY MONEY.

With all that said I hope that all PC gamers get their Epic keys on day one so they can play. I also hope that those same PC gamers get their Steam keys free when the exclusivity drops off. Only for backers of the Kickstarter. Steam was promised first so Steam should be delivered. I just don't want people to sink the Shenmue ship because of PC gaming beef. I wish everyone would take this same energy and tell Steam to increase their revenue kickback and alot of this would go away. At the end if the day Steam users have a right to be upset.
 
BruceWayne911 said:
It's not anti consumer it's good business. You can't expect anyone to turn down millions and a bigger slice of the pie. Businesses are here to make money thats the bottom line. Why do you think it's been almost 20 years since Shenmue 3? Developers have to believe there is money to be made. MONEY MONEY MONEY.

With all that said I hope that all PC gamers get their Epic keys on day one so they can play. I also hope that those same PC gamers get their Steam keys free when the exclusivity drops off. Only for backers of the Kickstarter. Steam was promised first so Steam should be delivered. I just don't want people to sink the Shenmue ship because of PC gaming beef. I wish everyone would take this same energy and tell Steam to increase their revenue kickback and alot of this would go away. At the end if the day Steam users have a right to be upset.
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None of this would go away. Even if Steam gave 100% to developpers, getting money upfront is still a more appealing offer.
You're right, you cant expect anyone to turn down millions. But it is anti-consumer. Because consumers paid already. We all love Shenmue. We all want YsNet to be successful. But we shouldn't give a pass for anything with a blind love. Making exclusive deals is okay when it comes to distribution. But if you include backers in those, that means you sold your backers. Backers should get what they paid for, period.

That's what a good business deal is: Exclusivity for release, not for backers.
 
BruceWayne911 said:
It's not anti consumer it's good business. You can't expect anyone to turn down millions and a bigger slice of the pie. Businesses are here to make money thats the bottom line. Why do you think it's been almost 20 years since Shenmue 3? Developers have to believe there is money to be made. MONEY MONEY MONEY.
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Epic isn't a consumer tho. You and I are consumers. If Deep Silver bypasses consumers to deal with Epic, so Epic can then forcibly drag us over, then that is indeed anti-consumer. Yes, Ys Net and Deep Silver obviously want to make money, but for them to make money they need to sell their product to consumers - again, you and me. They are choosing to deal directly with Epic, and we are an after thought.

BruceWayne911 said:
With all that said I hope that all PC gamers get their Epic keys on day one so they can play. I also hope that those same PC gamers get their Steam keys free when the exclusivity drops off.
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That's not what anyone wants. If I'm sent an Epic key, I will not play it and I will never support Yu Suzuki or Ys Net again, and the Shenmue series will die off.

BruceWayne911 said:
I just don't want people to sink the Shenmue ship because of PC gaming beef. I wish everyone would take this same energy and tell Steam to increase their revenue kickback and alot of this would go away. At the end if the day Steam users have a right to be upset.
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This isn't about a beef. If I choose not to support something, that is my choice. If Deep Silver tries to force me to use something I've chosen to not use, that is of their doing. Not mine. I've chosen not to use or support Epic long before this announcement, and Deep Silver won't change that.

It isn't our place to tell Steam how to operate their business. Just like it's not our doing to tell Sony or Nintendo how to operate their business either. We can give feedback, and if they want to build a good product and appease their userbase, they'll make changes to do that, but the way they manage profit distribution is up to them. There are alternatives. Epic could have been a nice alternative but instead of focusing on a good product, their approach is throwing money around and removing consumer choice.
 
Good business doesnt mean it isnt anti consumer. Business are corporations and capitalists. Its 100% about money. It is definitely anti consumer to value money over the demands of your customers. Without customers, there is no business. Abritriaily locking a game to a different platform than the one funded by the public in exchange for more money without any benefit to the consumer, solely to keep it off another store front is very much anti consumer. Not only is it anti consumer, it is anti competitive as its removing peoples choice that they previously had, as well as disallows other stores to sell it. And this is on a traditionally open platform.

It is total shennanigans. Just because Deep Silver wanted more money up front doesnt mean it is not bad for consumers. Sure it is good business, and a great deal for them but thats irrelevant.
 
JPZ said:
Will PC gamers be able to use a controller on Epic Games....?
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Yes.

Controller support is provided by DirectX DirectInput, it is not a function of the game platform. Steam just has additional controller functionality that allows more customization and controller support than you get without it. If you have an Xbox controller for PC it will work fine without Steam. You could also use Steam to launch the EGS version of the game and get the Steam Overlay. People did this with Metro Exodus, another EGS exclusive.
 
I understand the backlash now towards the whole Epic deal, but really imo we have no other choice but to fully support this decision towards Shenmue 3 whether we like it or not. I'm playing it on PS4 so I'm not affected either way, but I will buy a copy of Shenmue 3 on PC because I know where it's going.

In other words, knowing that Yu Suzuki will get 88% of Shenmue 3's PC sales, and getting licensed tools and tech for the UE means a damn near guarantee for Shenmue IV sooner rather than later.... with grab moves.
 
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