Did the 18-year wait damage the Shenmue Series?

Did the 18-year wait damage the Shenmue Series?

Today, I will share my opinions and feelings about this interesting topic.

Shenmue II was released in 2001, and Shenmue III was released in 2019. Personally, as a Shenmue fan since 2015, I didn't have to endure such a long wait since I completed Shenmue II for the first time in 2017. However, for many dedicated Shenmue fans, it was an 18-year wait.

I can imagine how difficult and painful it must have been to wait for news about whether the Shenmue Series would continue or not during that time. People must have spent a long time contemplating how the story would continue, what Shenmue III would look like, and developing various theories. They imagined if Ziming would appear, if Xiuying would return, if the other Chi You Men leaders would make an appearance, and much more.

So, my question is: Did these 18 years of waiting damage the Shenmue series? In my opinion, yes, unfortunately, it did a lot of damage, and I will explain why I feel this way.


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~ 18 Years of Hype ~

For 18 years, fans built up hype, constantly imagining Shenmue III, creating theories, and more. This was challenging for many people.

The expectations for Shenmue III were incredibly high because of this prolonged anticipation. As I mentioned, people had been theorizing and imagining how Shenmue III would look for so long that the hype and expectations reached extraordinary levels.

It's likely that people wanted to see Ziming, the other Chi You Men leaders, Xiuying's return, and all the things they had theorized and imagined for 18 years. However, this didn't happen, so it was a disappointment for them. But I believe these elements might appear in Shenmue IV, as Shenmue III focused on other aspects.

I can understand the desire for more things, but in my opinion, Shenmue is a slow-paced story. If Shenmue III had been released earlier, say in 2003 or 2004, people might have received the game better. One reason is that they would have waited less for a continuation, resulting in less hype. Since people had been waiting for 18 years, the hype was exceptionally high. Additionally, Shenmue III was a Kickstarter game, and Yu Suzuki was no longer with SEGA. It's sad, but that's how it is.

In my opinion, Shenmue III would have been better received by fans if it had been released earlier, even if the amount of story remained the same as what we got in 2019. Of course, I could be wrong. We will never know what would have happened at that time, but this is how I envision the situation.




~ The Ending of Shenmue ~

Another reason why I believe the 18-year wait did damage is that some people now want Shenmue to conclude immediately. After so many years, the Shenmue series was revived, but some fans want a resolution to the Shenmue series right now.

I have even seen some people suggesting that Shenmue III should have been the conclusion to the Shenmue series. What caused this? I think it was the 18-year wait.

Can you imagine if Shenmue had continued back in the day? I genuinely believe that many people would have been fine with the idea of more Shenmue games at that time.

Perhaps Shenmue III for Dreamcast or the original Xbox, Shenmue IV and V on PS3/Xbox 360, and maybe Shenmue VI for PS4 and Xbox One. In my opinion, it would have been epic this way, and I truly believe people would have accepted Shenmue continuing in this manner. But now, after 18 years, many people want closure, and they want it right now. It's truly disheartening to think about everything Yu Suzuki had to face to continue Shenmue.



yakuza-6-button-fin-1640117952745.jpg

It's unfortunate how people treat the Yakuza series differently compared to Shenmue. The Yakuza series has been able to tell the story of Kazuma Kiryu through seven games, while discussions about Shenmue suggest that Ryo's journey shouldn't have the same number of games.

In my opinion, Shenmue should also have the opportunity to have the same number of games to depict Ryo's journey. But what has caused this discrepancy? What has led some people to demand a conclusion to the Shenmue series right away? In my view, it's the 18 years of waiting. Now, some people no longer wish to wait; they want closure for the Shenmue series immediately.

I want to make it clear that I am not speaking negatively about the Yakuza series. I actually intend to play all the Yakuza games and will likely enjoy them. I'm simply expressing that Shenmue deserves the same level of appreciation and support.




~ Final Thoughts ~

In my opinion, the 18-year wait has had a significant negative impact on the Shenmue series. However, what truly matters is that the Shenmue series is now more vibrant than ever. We received Shenmue I & II HD, Shenmue III, and even a Shenmue anime, which was amazing. It is crucial for the Shenmue community to come together even more. I genuinely believe that, together, we can achieve Shenmue IV and Shenmue V, and perhaps even a second season of the anime.

I understand why some people yearn for resolution after such a long wait. However, I don't believe ending Shenmue just for the sake of ending it is the right approach. Considering the current situation, I think Yu Suzuki will likely aim to conclude the Shenmue series in Shenmue V. But as I've mentioned before, if Yu-san decides to finish it in Shenmue IV, I will respect and understand his reasons.

What are your thoughts on this topic? Do you believe the 18-year wait has harmed the Shenmue series? How do you envision the future of the Shenmue series moving forward? Please share your thoughts in the comments below. Thank you all for reading, and remember to cherish your friends and loved ones. See you in my next blog post. Bye, bye! Hiki ~



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I certainly agree that the 18- year wait was not good. Mike from Gang Entertainment even put out a funny video that no game could live up to 18 years of hype. Funny and true.

This is also why Shenmue 4 needs to happen now. This is already a small fan base and asking this group to wait much longer won’t work. There was plenty of momentum with the Kickstarter and Anime. Hopefully, YS Net found some way to deliver something. How much more can they ask of us fans?
 
Shenmue 3 was almost a time anomaly, it wasn't expected to happen at certain point, denied even by Yu-san.
But then he twitted a forklift picture, making a 15yrs in limbo game cause hard to match havoc. And despite all polemics, and bursts of hate, it sold well.
Yes, Shenmue 3 was NOT a failure, it didn't topped the culture icon status of previous two games but did well enough to ensure more games from YS.net and of course, a future for the series.

The RGG community is a inspiration: with their support and efforts, brought the series to the West; they're always discussing in constructive mode which scenarios and plot arcs could be covered in future installments and also endured unfortunate comments and acussations, even crossfire.

Personally, if we don't get updates this year left, I'll like (not demand) some words from Yu-san. Not talking about giving explanations, saying sorry, he doesn't owns nor deserve that.
I mean some heartwarm twitt, for example, telling dear fans why they should remain sharp and expecting news, why they should remain eager.
If it's the "Light AI" implementation what's delaying or even repurposing development -which I've been doubting last few days after reading back his goals relative the project- it would be helpful to clarify.
Because with a substantial enough update I truly believe most of us could forgive a release date lacking.

One couldn't blame the guy if he finish the series at 4th game, moreover it would be unfair and a demeanish to a great achievement, afaik unmatched.
He is getting demanded explanations, told how to make or promote games 🥲 on a monthly and sometimes weekly basis.
"C'mon Yu, move and find finance for my Shenmue.. Not in blockchain you con artist! ... Why are you releasing a no-Shenmue game now??"

I believe he sent a message recently going to watch a movie called "Free Guy".
 
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The RGG community is a inspiration: with their support and efforts, brought the series to the West; they're always discussing in constructive mode which scenarios and plot arcs could be covered in future installments and also endured unfortunate comments and acussations, even crossfire.
Er, not quite: that's maybe 10% of the, "fandom," that does that.

The other 90% are stupid memes, childishness and poor taste jokes about Majima, Nishkiyama and Kiryu being hot for each other.

RGG Japan's twitter posted 2 days ago (I think: may have been yesterday) about it being, "strong words," day in Japan (basically, words of wisdom and the like that stay with you, leave an impact) and they posted a couple of pictures from the games with profound quotes and then asked, "what is everyone's favourite, profound line from the series?"

A couple of Japanese Twitter accounts posted funny stuff, but the vast majority of them did post nice quotes.

Every and I mean EVERY English-speaking account from the west, posted silly, childish shit and the same ******* memes that have been posted for 6-7 years now.

It's borderline disgusting behaviour; I'm tired of seeing things I love get trashed and be not appreciated and that's been happening to things I've been into, for at least 19 years of my life (will be 34 this year): if you're not going to appreciate it for what it is, STFU.
 
I wonder if all those are real people or bots doing bot-things.
I've seen in other sites lots of bot red flags like a word suddenly triggering a offrail far beyond off the thread idea with all the suspicious users acting like bot.
For example, here in Spain the Word is omelette. Always, in a disturbing high number of online discussions, someone says "the true question is: omelette, add onion or not?" and after a decade of the same joke over and over ones expect people to pass and stay focused in the thread matter... No, like I said always a lot of users and usually the same jump into it. "Onion gaaa","how could you add onion?!" And I mean it, it goes to a one or two pages of omelette derail. You actually get tired of scrolling sometimes and there has been more than a few cases that the joke swallowed the OT, leaving it untouched almost.

For my notion of the RGG community, its just the evildoers from here. They (and you) are always sub-plotting over there, your hood in the forum. I wish that (and 7 main games) for Shenmue.
What you told me about flooding of meme a live "Ask me" from a RGG Studio member is just ugly as uploading hardcore porn. There's a time for everything, and that wasn't meme time... What a disrispect. I hope they got katanas mailed to their homes.
 
I do think in many ways the 18 year gap and the fact this wasn’t a traditionally backed and supported game meant, Shenmue 3 no matter how good would never live up to those expectations.

With that said fans weren’t just idly speculating based on what they wanted to see. During the games development there are many quotes from Suzuki, talking about how Shenmue 3 will provide more information on the poem and other story elements that were completely absent during the final game. You can find some quotes in this old thread.

I remember seeing sketches in pre-release materials with Ryo wearing a green Gi, waiting for that moment to appear in Shenmue 3. Was that a case of an eagle-eyes fan having wrong expectations?
 
Fair points and I largely agree. Having experienced both Shenmue 1 and 2 since they came out on Dreamcast, is both a blessing and a curse. Unfortunately, the long wait had a tremendously negative impact on the game. Both for how the game would fare for long-time fans' expectations and for how it would fare in the market. Let's talk about the market first.

Shenmue has never been that much of a popular game. It was one of the top bestselling Dreamcast games (probably because people wanted to see the fancy graphics), however only a small, but extremely dedicated cult following stayed with it. We loved it because of its storytelling and because of the groundbreaking new elements that it brought to the genre. Even so, it was a commercial failure with an astronomical budget, rendering it a no-no for the industry in terms of future installments. The mere existence of Shenmue 2 is in itself a miracle. Now for Shenmue III, after the first 10 years of waiting, I was finally convinced that I'd die without ever seeing the end of my favorite game series. Our lovely community proved me wrong. The sad fact is that Shenmue 3 couldn't have come out at a worse time. The market had been saturated by other, hugely popular action-adventure games, which further built upon the elements that Shenmue 1 introduced to the genre. Games such as the Yakuza series.

Some people say that Yakuza is a spiritual successor of Shenmue. This is a half-truth. I'd say it's heavily influenced, but a completely different game. And this is reflected on its sales as well. If anything, Yakuza is closer to GTA than to Shenmue. It's a game based heavily on action and the factor of wreaking havoc and having fun - rather than story. It's the same case as why GTA5 has sold more than triple the copies than RDR2, which is again a story-heavy narrative game. You can take any Yakuza game, change its story and it's still a Yakuza game. Inversely, we simply cannot imagine a Shenmue without Ryo seeking revenge for his father's death. This is exactly why Yakuza has so many installments and they all sell well. It's not so much that the player wants to see the story of Kiryu - but to be alongside Kiryu and have fun beating people, preferably with a nice story to go along with it. The story of Shenmue doesn't need 7 games to be concluded, because the narrative might as well alternate between faster and slower intervals. But the Yakuza series can really go on and on, especially now after the reboot. New characters, new environments, more people to beat up. To avoid misunderstanding, I love all the Yakuza games, just not nearly as much as I love Shenmue.

Unfortunately, the majority of players are always bored with heavily story-based games with a slow pace, like Shenmue. But even long-time fans may end up disappointed when the third installment comes almost 20 years later. Because the bar had been set very high and one expects innovation again. This is why I was a little bit disappointed with Shenmue 3. To avoid going off-topic, let's just say I expected a bit more personality to it. As a bonus, I think it would be better aesthetically if Suzuki-san used the same engine - or a similar one - to the Dragon Engine (the engine that was used for Yakuza 0 and Kiwami). To conclude, I hope that we see a Shenmue 4 in our lifetimes. And it's totally fine for the story to end there. Yu always finds a way!
 
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This question is hard to answer. In general, an 18-year-old gap is always bad to damage the reputation. The fans are getting older and some might grow out of gaming completely so maybe a big percentage of the audience might get lost due to the delay.

The public standing of Shenmue was not good back then as well though. The fabase remained the same despite the big gap. So nothing really changed.

Shenmue is Shenmue. You either like or you hate it. It was an anthesis of your average modern game back then and it is still not your average modern game.
 
Fair points and I largely agree. Having experienced both Shenmue 1 and 2 since they came out on Dreamcast, is both a blessing and a curse. Unfortunately, the long wait had a tremendously negative impact on the game. Both for how the game would fare for long-time fans' expectations and for how it would fare in the market. Let's talk about the market first.

Shenmue has never been that much of a popular game. It was one of the top bestselling Dreamcast games (probably because people wanted to see the fancy graphics), however only a small, but extremely dedicated cult following stayed with it. We loved it because of its storytelling and because of the groundbreaking new elements that it brought to the genre. Even so, it was a commercial failure with an astronomical budget, rendering it a no-no for the industry in terms of future installments. The mere existence of Shenmue 2 is in itself a miracle. Now for Shenmue III, after the first 10 years of waiting, I was finally convinced that I'd die without ever seeing the end of my favorite game series. Our lovely community proved me wrong. The sad fact is that Shenmue 3 couldn't have come out at a worse time. The market had been saturated by other, hugely popular action-adventure games, which further built upon the elements that Shenmue 1 introduced to the genre. Games such as the Yakuza series.

Some people say that Yakuza is a spiritual successor of Shenmue. This is a half-truth. I'd say it's heavily influenced, but a completely different game. And this is reflected on its sales as well. If anything, Yakuza is closer to GTA than to Shenmue. It's a game based heavily on action and the factor of wreaking havoc and having fun - rather than story. It's the same case as why GTA5 has sold more than triple the copies than RDR2, which is again a story-heavy narrative game. You can take any Yakuza game, change its story and it's still a Yakuza game. Inversely, we simply cannot imagine a Shenmue without Ryo seeking revenge for his father's death. This is exactly why Yakuza has so many installments and they all sell well. It's not so much that the player wants to see the story of Kiryu - but to be alongside Kiryu and have fun beating people, preferably with a nice story to go along with it. The story of Shenmue doesn't need 7 games to be concluded, because the narrative might as well alternate between faster and slower intervals. But the Yakuza series can really go on and on, especially now after the reboot. New characters, new environments, more people to beat up. To avoid misunderstanding, I love all the Yakuza games, just not nearly as much as I love Shenmue.

Unfortunately, the majority of players are always bored with heavily story-based games with a slow pace, like Shenmue. But even long-time fans may end up disappointed when the third installment comes almost 20 years later. Because the bar had been set very high and one expects innovation again. This is why I was a little bit disappointed with Shenmue 3. To avoid going off-topic, let's just say I expected a bit more personality to it. As a bonus, I think it would be better aesthetically if Suzuki-san used the same engine - or a similar one - to the Dragon Engine (the engine that was used for Yakuza 0 and Kiwami). To conclude, I hope that we see a Shenmue 4 in our lifetimes. And it's totally fine for the story to end there. Yu always finds a way!

Great post; one series is indeed anthology-esque (with some ties to previous installments), but the callbacks are few and far between: you can pick up each title and not be caught off guard with story beat and plot devices, whereas with 'mue, you absolutely NEED the context f the previous games, as it is more episodic in nature.

In today's world, the first format will absolutely garner more fans, as there is less baggage tied to the series than the latter.

BTW, Dragon engine was NOT used for Kiwami and 0: that was the engine that was first used with 5 and 6 was the frst Dragon engine game ;)
 
BTW, Dragon engine was NOT used for Kiwami and 0: that was the engine that was first used with 5 and 6 was the frst Dragon engine game ;)
Wait a minute, I believed that Dragon was the engine for the whole saga and it went over iterations to reach actual state of the art.
So its fairly recent Sega technology then? Bruh that raises my expectations for Shenmue and Virtua Fighter official news.
We're out of official updates but the road is paved with many helping factors to believe that both series are likely cooking.
I like to look at how well has YS.net positioned and developed relationship with other companies full of talent over, these couple of years. They were like lonebullets at S3 days but today YS.net swims alongside big fishes.
 
I understand the points about the Yakuza Series, i didn't play the Yakuza games, just the beginning of the first one on PS2 a long time ago, but i have plans to play all the Yakuza games so i need to play before giving my opinion, but i will probably enjoy the Yakuza series, i just think is sad because i believe that the Shenmue series deserves the same level of appreciation and support

In VF 5 Ultimate Showdown we got a Yakuza DLC but nothing about Shenmue DLC, it is Shenmue that have a connection with VF, i'm not against the Yakuza DLC, i even bought this DLC, but yes to me Shenmue deserves the same level of appreciation and support, but that's not what happens, what happens is people hitting Shenmue really hard in every possible way, some people really love to hate Shenmue.

Shenmue doesn't get the love it deserves, Yu Suzuki don't get the credit he deserves, but that's just my opinion.

It is sad because clearly Yu Suzuki wants to tell his story at his own pace, as someone who create stories myself i don't want to speed the pace of my story just to finish quickly, but about Shenmue now after 18 years people want closure right now and i understand that, but i don't agree ending Shenmue just for the sake of ending, to me the slow pace style of Shenmue is a beautiful way to tell a story.

If Yu Suzuki say he needs 2 more games i will be okay with that, if he say he needs 3 more games i will be okay, but in the current situation i think the best decision will be to finish in the fifth game, but if Yu-san decides to finish the series in Shenmue IV i will really understand and respect his reasons.

I'm not speaking negatively about the Yakuza Series, i even want to make a post here in the blog to share my opinion that is important that the 2 fanbases respect each other, that there is no need for fight and hate between Shenmue fanbase and Yakuza fanbase, some people enjoy both series and i think this will probably happen to me as well, i think i will enjoy the Yakuza series, i just think that Shenmue deserves the same level of appreciation and support

To me sadly the 18 years wait did damage to the Shenmue series because of the reasons i said in my blog post, i just hope Yu-san can finish Shenmue in a way that will be satisfying for him as well, is his story after all.
 
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I do not hate the Yakuza series by any means they are neat little games but they should not be mixed up with Shenmue. They are no replacement for Shenmue and they are no spiritual successor. The only thing they have in common is that both games are made by Sega and both Games place in Japan. That's it. From a technical point of view, the first Yakuza game was inferior to Shenmue. The core design was much worse. The waypoints are super fickle. You really need to stand in a certain way to trigger a story event. It feels so clunky and can be annoying especially Yakuza 4 when you had to escape from the police with Saejima.

Genre wise both games are also different. Yakuza is a brawler game like Streets of Rage while Shenmue is an adventure game with some action elements.

Shenmue will always get hurt due to the Shenmueness but that makes the game great. I would be against an experiment to chance Shenmue to make it more popular. Yu Suzuki should finish the series on his terms if he can do that.

I am willing to wait.
 
BTW, Dragon engine was NOT used for Kiwami and 0: that was the engine that was first used with 5 and 6 was the frst Dragon engine game ;)
Ah yes, my bad. I meant the engine used in Yakuza 0 and Kiwami 1. The style would really suit Shenmue 3 in my opinion.

i have plans to play all the Yakuza games
I highly recommend starting from Yakuza 0. You can find both 0 and Kiwami on Steam at 5 euros/dollars during a sale, which Sega does multiple times a year ;)
 
Wait a minute, I believed that Dragon was the engine for the whole saga and it went over iterations to reach actual state of the art.
So its fairly recent Sega technology then? Bruh that raises my expectations for Shenmue and Virtua Fighter official news.
We're out of official updates but the road is paved with many helping factors to believe that both series are likely cooking.
I like to look at how well has YS.net positioned and developed relationship with other companies full of talent over, these couple of years. They were like lonebullets at S3 days but today YS.net swims alongside big fishes.
Indeed, Dragon engine was first used for 6 and when compared side by side with 0 (which came out soon after), you can see the differences quite a bit.

I highly recommend starting from Yakuza 0. You can find both 0 and Kiwami on Steam at 5 euros/dollars during a sale, which Sega does multiple times a year ;)

I'm still of the school of thought to start chronologically: yeah 0 is first canonically, but there are numerous callbacks and the like that are lost on you if you start first with it.

Also, 0 is a better game than 1 and if given the choice, I always save the better for later.
 
Now that I think about it, did a 16 year wait between the prequel trilogy and the original trilogy hurt Star Wars? Did a 14 year wait between the prequel and sequel trilogies hurt it? Or did the overall the 36 year gap between the original trilogy and sequel trilogies hurt it?

I mean, Star Wars at least had the Extended Universe such as Heir to the Empire and Shadows of the Empire to give us more Star Wars, but we didn't get that with Shenmue during that gap. In context to Star Wars, it did both IMHO, and perhaps the same can be said about Shenmue 3 just depending on how you look at it.

It's really crazy to think in that 18 year wait, a piece of me was still that 17-year-old who first played Shenmue 2 and was taken away by that ending that gave us more questions than answers. I felt a significant part of me didn't "grow up" until I played Shenmue 3 because I've always wanted it. I felt I couldn't die until I played the next installment of Shenmue. I waited...and I did.

Ideally, we would've loved to have seen the Dreamcast go worldwide until 2007 and 2008 and still see Shenmue continue on the Dreamcast, but we have to deal with the world we live in. Whatever "regrets" I have in regard to Shenmue 3, is out of my control. It was 85% the game I expected it to be, so I'm largely satisfied with it. I came into the game (and always have come into it) knowing that we wouldn't get any solid conclusion, and I feel that a good percentage of the "disappointment" comes from how people were unreasonably expecting a conclusion.

As for Yakuza, yes, 0-6 tells the story of Kazuma Kiryu, but you can largely play them out of order and they weren't meant to tell a continuous story like Shenmue (yes, some elements of previous games do carry over, etc, and I do think you need to play 4 in order to understand the context of Majima's situation in 0). I still think comparing Yakuza/Like A Dragon to Shenmue is comparing apples to oranges, but in this case, the apples and oranges here come from the same farm.
 
18 year wait watered down the already limited brand if Shenmue. Despite shenmue best efforts to get a foothold it continues to get slapped back down.
 
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