Kickstarter Update #102 - PC Gaming Show Update: New Trailer & Epic Games Store Exclusive for PC Version!

[Amir]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone, or some team will have crunched the numbers here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

I can't claim to be an insider on the deals Epic makes, but apparently they often offer deals which guarantee a certain amount of revenue regardless of sales. Also, devs make more money per sale:

"Developers receive 88% of revenue... And if you’re using Unreal Engine, Epic will cover the 5% engine royalty for sales on the Epic Games store, out of Epic’s 12%."

For comparison, Valve often takes up to 30% per sale.

 

[Dietsoap]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone , or some team will have crunched the numbers here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

I know this isn't exactly what you asked for, but my fear is that DS made this deal to cover their investment costs (and then some), and don't really care what happens to Shenmue after the fact. They may have already made their profit on S3 with this deal and are just considering potential PS4 sales a nice little bonus at this point. I doubt any of that money went to YsNet.

 

[JPZ]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone , or some team will have crunched the numbers here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

Perhaps development needed the extra funds or believed it could help the finished product?

Steam has a massive market share for PC games and they could be losing out on a large amount of potential sales.

 

[RunningWolf]

I see nothing but thumbs down on YouTube videos. That's not good at all.

 

[Alexironaek]

Sorry guys but I really don't get it...
i bought a PS4 just for shenmue 3. They could announce that they are canceling the PS4 version and that they will release the game only on Xbox one (I don't own one) and I'd stiil be happy we are getting Shenmue 3....

I couldn't care less about cloud saves and game sharing ext.

I'm not saying that you don't have the right to be angry... I'm saying that I just don't get it...

 

[ShenSun]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone, or some team will have crunched the numbers here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

I think the fear is, if Shenmue 3 becomes a viral meme such as "This is the game that screwed over backers" therefore we shouldn't support it when it launches. This is where issues will arise with potential sales.

Deep Silver is a publisher. If EPIC came to them with big money, i'm not surprised they took it. Plus developers get more money when sales are made on the EPIC store.

I'm not sure what Deep Silver are doing anymore. The release date update. This update. I'm almost scared to see what they'll pull next.

They have to honor the backers though. It is very unethical & distasteful not to do so, and that's what will ultimately decide Shenmue's fate in the public eye.

 

[Space Lion]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone, or some team will have crunched the numbrs here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

Unfortunately Peter, all we can do is wait.

It's mixed. On one, this is a betrayal to consumer trust especially with the fact that they've readily advertised for Steam version - even as far as making an actual Steam page for the game. On the other, some games have sold well despite non-Steam exclusivity over the years. If people really want them they'll find them. The problem with that is the utter fact that usually the ones that survive these migrations, such as EA and Ubi games or even Microsoft games, is the fact that they're usually big franchises already. Shenmue, comparatively, is niche. It needed a Kickstarter to get off the ground to make the third entry even possible and it's for the best that Shenmue III be accessible to as many platforms and storefronts as possible to put as many eyeballs as possible on it.

So it could go either way. One issue right now is the exclusivity. If it were a timed exclusive it would be fine, but they have made no mention of timed exclusive. Finally, there's the fact that we are confirming that even those of us who ordered a Steam Key will not be honored that.

So people are stuck. Honestly, all signs point to a poor sales outlook.

This is very, very bad because Shenmue being on multple systems at release is a very big deal. I and II were placed on system lock down and suffereed for it because Dreamcast wasn't popular enough. Microsoft buying Shenmue II exclusivity from Sega of America made things explode in their face even more.

This deal sounds more like IIx than anything else: flipping the script months before release only to reveal it isn't coming to the platform it was advertised as being for years and years.

They can do a few things to change course:

1. announce that kick starters who ordered pc WILL be offered their game on steam if they so chose it.
2. make it a timed exclusive

 

[itani]

I found their new Kickstarter update very insensitive too. How did they think this would go? Whoever runs the Kickstarter has been bad from the start imo

 

[Valascaziel]

I'm not well versed, but it seems purely money for publisher.

Possibly to recoup investment costs if the product fails. There isn't really any other reason. It most likely is to make some extra money if the game bombs. They get a much bigger slice of the pie on EGS, which is an inherently inferior platform.

This was purely for monetarial gain on the part of Deep Silver. You don't anger that much of a fan base on a whim.

I think they evaluated the project, realized it needs more help and may not be as quality as they hoped.

They negotiated the delay, gave Yu 3 months to fix what we can, punched the deal for more money and here we are. The delay and this deal go hand in hand, I'm sure of that.


3 months isn't a whole lot of time to clean up the project; its fair, but this game is obviously struggling--not saying there aren't improvements, but it needs more time. Maybe he can work some magic.

This is my take on it.

 

[JPZ]

Sorry guys but I really don't get it...
i bought a PS4 just for shenmue 3. They could announce that they are canceling the PS4 version and that they will release the game only on Xbox one (I don't own one) and I'd stiil be happy we are getting Shenmue 3....

I couldn't care less about cloud saves and game sharing ext.

I'm not saying that you don't have the right to be angry... I'm saying that I just don't get it...

Sure, but a lot of PC gamers really do care about those things and only use Steam because all their games, achievements, rewards and gamer friends are on there. Using another platform is a deal-breaker for them.

 

[jasonorme666]

Everywhere I look its bad.. the kickstarter page, twitter, steam, youtube... it's as if people have forgotten how long we have waited for this.

I'm not exactly pleased.. and I understand peoples anger to an extent, but even the die-hard fans have turned..

 

[WildManofBorneo]

Can i ask some advice, as a non PC gamer who has no dog in this race, a question? Also, i cannot emphasise this enough, i would like impartial, unbiased, black and white facts if possible:

how does this benefit Shenmue? More specifically, financially, and in terms of the future of the franchise.

The reason i want simple black and white facts here, is because i am simply going into this from an outsider perspective, and here's where i am at. So there's this HUGE negative backlash from backers, and my obvious emotion is fear and worry about the series. Is this damaging to the series from a financial standpoint. From what i can see, there are predictions that this move will seriously hamper sales.... OK. Whilst those are predictions/opinions, lets take those as fact.
I just cannot get my head around how Deep Silver, or whoever made this call, sat down and made a decision that would hamper their profits from their investment from doing something like this. Its illogical. It wouldn't have been done on a whim, or a roll of the dice. Someone, or some team will have crunched the numbers here and decided that this was best to ensure the most profits. I remember some facts a while back about sales percentages being better than Steam, as well as something about the Unreal engine?

I am just trying to get some facts going, and hopefully some sort of hope that this series isn't dead, or left hanging, as some of you are predicting. Deep Silver have invested in this project, and i just don't understand the logic that they will do that, then make such a drastic move such as this, to jeopardise the profits from that investment.

Obviously Deep Silver is aware of the backlash that they faced from Metro: Exodus and its subsequent impact on sales. If they felt that the Epic deal would truly jeopardize Shenmue 3 profits, they wouldn't have agreed to it. How much did Epic give Deep Silver to ensure exclusivity? Evidently an amount that is more than they could have generated through Steam sales.

Does anyone actually believe that Deep Silver & Koch Media have managed to build successful businesses over the years through means which could be financially detrimental to profits? I think not.

 

[Stiz]

The backers who bought the game if it is being sent to epic store then there may be no steam keys. I looked at some of the comment there. Cry me a freaking river... Blame steam for charging 30% profit and epic only taking 12-16% profit on each game sold. Wow!!!! What is wrong with using a different client? Will it kill you?

 

[ShenSun]

Jesus, the backers are demanding money back
Shenmue 3 videos have mass thumb downs
Sites picking up the story everywhere.
Youtubers starting to pick it up.

How did this all go so wrong?

 

[Stiz]

There is something I hate about people on a NSFW site and on YouTube. The bandwagon hopping things they say they will do if a game goes to epic... Pirate. Most the people making said comments probably do not care about the game on YouTube. Go ahead kickstarter supporters pirate the game and have the game fail. Long time fans should not act like this.

 

[Raithos]

I won't argue or debate with anyone, as we are all entitled to our opinions, but I backed a STEAM copy of the game. Having used the EGS its not consumer friendly, and lacks very, very basic features. Its been noted in this thread already. Its the truth. Its absolutely bare bones compared to all other digital platforms on PC. Its not what I backed. Its not what was advertised.

The update is just as bad as the move to EGS. They announce the partnership with a ! at the end like the PC backers were going to love it. Deep Silver knew exactly what they were doing after the backlash from Metro. This is purely a money grab on their part.

I spoke with my wallet to fund this and I'll speak with my wallet again with a refund. If Kickstarter tries to deny it, my CC company will snatch the money back like it was never in their pocket to begin with. I love this series to death but I'm a consumer, not a fanboy. You won't pull a bait and switch on me in the last few months.

The publicity from this will do nothing but harm Shenmue and YS Net.

 

[jasonorme666]

What is wrong with using a different client? Will it kill you?

Its rather annoying when you have Steam, Uplay, Origin, Battlenet , Bethesda Launcher, Twitch, Gog, and now the Epic Store.
Sure, it doesn't take long to download another client, but still..

 

[Tosh]

I'm not well versed, but it seems purely money for publisher.

Possibly to recoup investment costs if the product fails. There isn't really any other reason. It most likely is to make some extra money if the game bombs. They get a much bigger slice of the pie on EGS, which is an inherently inferior platform.

This was purely for monetarial gain on the part of Deep Silver. You don't anger that much of a fan base on a whim.

I think they evaluated the project, realized it needs more help and may not be as quality as they hoped.

They negotiated the delay, gave Yu 3 months to fix what we can, punched the deal for more money and here we are. The delay and this deal go hand in hand, I'm sure of that.


3 months isn't a whole lot of time to clean up the project; its fair, but this game is obviously struggling--not saying there aren't improvements, but it needs more time. Maybe he can work some magic.

This is my take on it.

well the other question is, if there would be no publisher like Deep Silver
and Shenmue 3 would ended just as a Kickstarter game with the 7 million budget and the final release around 2017 / 2018,
what game would we have now? i mean take the up to date footage we have now
and then imagine the look and depth of everything with just the Kickstarter budget
and probably more than a year less time for developing.

i think the outcome would be pretty "special".

 

[Space Lion]

A big impediment for this game is the Kickstarter. If backers aren’t given an option for steam keys they’ll rightfully revolt which will result in people not invested in shenmue criticize the project by proxy because no one likes seeing fellow gamers get ripped off and this is how it’ll be interpreted evem if it’s not wrong).

 

[Stiz]

Jesus, the backers are demanding money back
Shenmue 3 videos have mass thumb downs
Sites picking up the story everywhere.
Youtubers starting to pick it up.

How can this all go so wrong?

There is a specific youtuber that pisses me off. Anything that goes to epic he rallies his brain dead followers to say they will not support the game going to epic. I bet they were not fans also.