Steam vs Epic Games

[Van Joel Sandwich]

Well there's a reply up there explaining why for a single player games, it can make a difference too. For some people, crucial to the point of even playing the game (see disabilities or Linux support).

I don't know man.
People played games and enjoyed them way before Steam was a thing. Why are many people so dependant of the platform now? (there can be many reasons I guess)
Anyway. Good for you that love Steam so much.
I hope the devotion for Steam doesn't eclipse the love for Shenmue tho.
Im going to play it on ps4 and will buy it also on Epic store. I don't care about the store nor launcher, I want the game.

 

[GhostTrick]

I don't know man.
People played games and enjoyed them way before Steam was a thing. Why are many people so dependant of the platform now? (there can be many reasons I guess)
Anyway. Good for you that love Steam so much.
I hope the devotion for Steam doesn't eclipse the love for Shenmue tho.
Im going to play it on ps4 and will buy it also on Epic store. I don't care about the store nor launcher, I want the game.

There's a lenghty reply to your concerns.
How did some people did before ? Well, some just couldn't. Plain and simple.
But guess what, I'll listen to you. I'll just say to people for exemple with disabilities that cant access to full control remapping which Steam includes and EGS doesnt that, according to "Joel Van Sandwich" that they can "fuck off it's just a different launcher how did you do before".

Listen, that you dont care is fine. Props to you ! Maybe some people care and have an actual reason to care ?
Like, as I said, I wouldn't care if the PS4 version was cancelled. I wouldn't care if it was delayed. Heck I wouldn't care if performance was bad. Because I wouldn't be impacted. Does it mean others shouldn't care ?

But no, according to you it's "omg you loove steam lololol".
That's a bit shortsighted imo. And if you ever care about having a reaosnable discussion around it that isn't about your not so subtle taunts (we get it, you love your PS4), I'd be glad to have it in a civil and respectful manner. It doesn't have to be a "us vs them" you know.

 

[abaww]

There's a lenghty reply to your concerns.
How did some people did before ? Well, some just couldn't. Plain and simple.
But guess what, I'll listen to you. I'll just say to people for exemple with disabilities that cant access to full control remapping which Steam includes and EGS doesnt that, according to "Joel Van Sandwich" that they can "fuck off it's just a different launcher how did you do before".

Listen, that you dont care is fine. Props to you ! Maybe some people care and have an actual reason to care ?
Like, as I said, I wouldn't care if the PS4 version was cancelled. I wouldn't care if it was delayed. Heck I wouldn't care if performance was bad. Because I wouldn't be impacted. Does it mean others shouldn't care ?

But no, according to you it's "omg you loove steam lololol".
That's a bit shortsighted imo. And if you ever care about having a reaosnable discussion around it that isn't about your not so subtle taunts (we get it, you love your PS4), I'd be glad to have it in a civil and respectful manner. It doesn't have to be a "us vs them" you know.

this

 

[Van Joel Sandwich]

There's a lenghty reply to your concerns.
How did some people did before ? Well, some just couldn't. Plain and simple.
But guess what, I'll listen to you. I'll just say to people for exemple with disabilities that cant access to full control remapping which Steam includes and EGS doesnt that, according to "Joel Van Sandwich" that they can "fuck off it's just a different launcher how did you do before".

Listen, that you dont care is fine. Props to you ! Maybe some people care and have an actual reason to care ?
Like, as I said, I wouldn't care if the PS4 version was cancelled. I wouldn't care if it was delayed. Heck I wouldn't care if performance was bad. Because I wouldn't be impacted. Does it mean others shouldn't care ?

But no, according to you it's "omg you loove steam lololol".
That's a bit shortsighted imo. And if you ever care about having a reaosnable discussion around it that isn't about your not so subtle taunts (we get it, you love your PS4), I'd be glad to have it in a civil and respectful manner. It doesn't have to be a "us vs them" you know.

Dude, you sure take this things seriously. lol
And you surely make some great spins to what I said.
Like I really think that people with disabilities should fuck off .
Your an avid Steam defensor I see
I guess your making justice to your name, playing ghost tricks into conversations. LOL

 

[Reprise]

I'm really impressed by your deep and critical analysis of the problem.

I'm really impressed by the mental gymnastics and intentionally convoluted analysis some PC gamers are pushing to hide the fact all they paid for was a PC version, which is still being fulfilled, regardless of how shit Epic may or may not be.

And that will be the final thing I say on the matter. I'm moving on to more positive discussions :)

 

[spud1897]

Here's a question then. Just throwing it out there....

If Epic introduced similar benefits to Steam in terms of options/feature so etc so they are on par, or near enough, would we even be having this discussion?

 

[Tosh]

Here's a question then. Just throwing it out there....

If Epic introduced similar benefits to Steam in terms of options/feature so etc so they are on par, or near enough, would we even be having this discussion?

probably yes because a lot of people just want their one steam game library with all the games in one place and nothing else,
they already hated Uplay and Origin, thats why i think at this point it doesnt really matter
how good or bad some store or launcher will be, a lot of people simply dont want it.
i think the only other shop people are okay with is GOG.

i dont care by the way, i think i have every launcher on my pc there is and a PS4.

 

[spud1897]

probably yes because a lot of people just want their one steam game library with all the games in one place and nothing else,
they already hated Uplay and Origin, thats why i think at this point it doesnt really matter
how good or bad some store or launcher will be, a lot of people simply dont want it.
i think the only other shop people are okay with is GOG.

i dont care by the way, i think i have every launcher on my pc there is and a PS4.

It's just something that popped into my head.

If the stores were near equal then it comes down to personal preference more than anything.

 

[Reprise]

For the record, as I said before to GhostTrust, I understand people's frustrations and I'm sorry I dismissed them so easily.

What really angers me though is how toxic the PC side is outside of this forum. There's frustrstion or upset, and then there's people who post at least 5 or 6 angry comments/replies on social media under any post to do with Shenmue, that offer nothing but vitriol and attacks that are reminiscent of a toddler stamping their feet and destroying everything in their path. No one here is acting like that fortunately.

 

[Tosh]

It's just something that popped into my head.

If the stores were near equal then it comes down to personal preference more than anything.

yeah but Steam was the first thing that did this and now Steam is like the official launcher for PC players,
everything else is just a "rip off". it is very hard to convince people to use something different
when they already have everything they need. Origin, Uplay, Blizzard Launcher only can enforce this
because those exclusive games are their own games and they know
that people wont say no to Battlefield or Overwatch or Assassins Creed.
but Epic doesnt really have this choice, they have some exclusives here and some exclusives there
but nothing big enough to force / convince players. (the sceptical ones)

but of course this doesnt mean that everything else is doomed,
Steam has the biggest english speaking community, they are the loudest PC community.
but there are still millions of people on Origin, Uplay and so on, you just dont hear anything from them.

 

[DigitalDuck]

i think the only other shop people are okay with is GOG.

It's almost as though people like platforms that aren't anti-consumer.

 

[GhostTrick]

Here's a question then. Just throwing it out there....

If Epic introduced similar benefits to Steam in terms of options/feature so etc so they are on par, or near enough, would we even be having this discussion?

I think there'd be less outrage. Why ? Because people would still be forced on a platform but wouldn't suffer from a terrible launcher.

To put it in light words: The Epic Games launcher exists since 2014/2015. Feature wise, it's lagging 10 years behind the competition. For the record, Steam supported cloud saves in 2009.

But it also comes down to the store/Epic's policy. From the way they see it, they want to have a key generation control on the games sold on their store. Which means only stores approved by Epic can sell Epic keys. Not stores approved by the publishers but by Epic. This widely limit the freedom and competition on the market because that means in Epic's mind, the one allowing 3rd party stores to exist is basically... A 1st party store. Basically in Epic's mind, they're the one to decide if they can have competitors or not.

That's... Dangerous to say the least. Hence why there's a lot of pushback and people not wanting to let them gain marketshare.

 

[Tosh]

It's almost as though people like platforms that aren't anti-consumer.

its your own choice. you dont have to support anything but we all know that it will not get any better.
this exclusive stuff will always be there. there is no going back, Origin, Uplay, Blizzard and so on will always be there,
and Epic will throw in as much money as they can. we already know that the next big thing they have is Borderlands 3
and Epic already has 85 mil registered users right now. if they can manage to buy more exclusive games from different genres,
they will slowly grow because there are a lot of players who are way too impatient.

i dont care about this stuff,
back in the day i bought consoles because of just one game, i also had different accounts on PS3 and Xbox 360 and PS4,
i never cared about having all trophies or games on one account. i had to deal with exclusive games for 25 years or so,
i dont see it as bad or good, its just how it is
and to me it doesnt matter what launcher i have to start.

 

[GhostTrick]

its your own choice. you dont have to support anything but we all know that it will not get any better.
this exclusive stuff will always be there. there is no going back, Origin, Uplay, Blizzard and so on will always be there,
and Epic will throw in as much money as they can. we already know that the next big thing they have is Borderlands 3
and Epic already has 85 mil registered users right now. if they can manage to buy more exclusive games from different genres,
they will slowly grow because there are a lot of players who are way too impatient.

i dont care about this stuff,
back in the day i bought consoles because of just one game, i also had different accounts on PS3 and Xbox 360 and PS4,
i never cared about having all trophies or games on one account. i had to deal with exclusive games for 25 years or so,
i dont see it as bad or good, its just how it is
and to me it doesnt matter what launcher i have to start.

Epic has 85 millions registered account. But this doesn't mean they have 85 millions registered users. They had maybe as much account registered before the store was live because of Fortnite. And F2P users rarely converts into buyers, according to Sergey Galyonkin, who is the SteamSpy admin... And now one of the heads of the Epic store.

 

[Tosh]

Epic has 85 millions registered account. But this doesn't mean they have 85 millions registered users. They had maybe as much account registered before the store was live because of Fortnite. And F2P users rarely converts into buyers, according to Sergey Galyonkin, who is the SteamSpy admin... And now one of the heads of the Epic store.

if Epic will go on with this exclusive way where they are buying games like Borderlands, Metro and whatever is coming,
they will grow. people nowadays are paying 15-20€ (on top of 60) just for a 3 day headstart for one game because they dont want to wait.
there are tons of people who are way too impatient to wait until a 6-12 month exclusive deal ends.
so if Epic is confident enough and can find more partners, they can enforce the Epic launcher
exactly like Uplay, Origin and co does because there will be more than enough impatient players.

 

[GhostTrick]

if Epic will go on with this exclusive way where they are buying games like Borderlands, Metro and whatever is coming,
they will grow. people nowadays are paying 15-20€ (on top of 60) just for a 3 day headstart for one game because they dont want to wait.
there are tons of people who are way too impatient to wait until a 6-12 month exclusive deal ends.
so if Epic is confident enough and can find more partners, they can enforce the Epic launcher
exactly like Uplay, Origin and co does because there will be more than enough impatient players.

They will grow but from what point ? Since that 85M number is already biased.

And it doesn't change one important thing: At some point, they'll have to stop exclusives. What will be the incentive to buy from them ?

 

[Reprise]

Okay, so I wish to have a legitimate conversation on this point. Are all exclusivity deals anti-consumer? Should they be outlawed? Because, as it stands, they have existed since the dawn of time. There's nothing morally or legally wrong with companies paying for exclusivity. Why are we acting like this is something new?

Examples:

- Batman the Animated Series Complete Collection - exclusive to HMV in the UK

- Power Rangers Legacy Collection - exclusive to A1 Toys in the UK

- Various comics and variant covers - exclusive to various comic stores

- Xenoblade Chronicles - exclusive to GameStop in NA / Project Zero 5 - exclusive to GAME in the UK

- Every exclusive video game ever that wasn't funded/supported by the console manufacturer

(Edit: I am only talking about exclusivity - since the word "anti-consumer" is used against Epic - not whether it is morally ok to take a funded KS project and gain exclusivity)

 

[Tosh]

They will grow but from what point ? Since that 85M number is already biased.

And it doesn't change one important thing: At some point, they'll have to stop exclusives. What will be the incentive to buy from them ?

if they can find steady partners, there will be a point where they dont have to pay extra for exclusivity.
the game will be automatically exclusive because of the partnership and thats it.
and then it will be nothing else than Origin or Blizzard Launcher, where people are just using it because of 1-3 games.
it will take some time but you can enforce this on players if you have the right brands
because even if there will be a loud uproar, in the end a lot of players still want to play it.
and even if they dont like the launcher or shop, they are still paying money.
the shop owner doesnt care if you paid it with pleasure or not.

 

[GhostTrick]

if they can find steady partners, there will be a point where they dont have to pay extra for exclusivity.
the game will be automatically exclusive because of the partnership and thats it.
and then it will be nothing else than Origin or Blizzard Launcher, where people are just using it because of 1-3 games.
it will take some time but you can enforce this on players if you have the right brands
because even if there will be a loud uproar, in the end a lot of players still want to play it.
and even if they dont like the launcher or shop, they are still paying money.
the shop owner doesnt care if you paid it with pleasure or not.

Why would someone refuse to sell elsewhere ?
What's the point ? Why not sell on both ?

Who in their right mind would be like "Instead of selling to two pools of people... I'm just going to sell to one smaller one, for no benefit".

 

[xatruio]

Always hear about PC sales numbers tend to be lower than a console game's PS4/XBOX counterpart, but even with the advent of XBL and PSN, PC games have a longer shelf life, yeah? Regardless of the Epic exclusivity, wouldn't it be logical to assume after a year there'd still be selling potential for Shenmue on PC, especially opening to a new audience on Steam? Sucks to wait, but I wonder how many potential late buyers/casual fans were already going to wait about a year or more, anyway.