Sonic the Hedgehog thread

I don’t like the “combat.” I like the principle Sonic gameplay of running through cool obstacles, jumping on/avoiding enemies. They never really manage to achieve good level design w/ their 3D titles and this looks like a lazy way around that, pushing random floating rails and “puzzles” that slow you down. We’ll see. I think it’s time to hand Sonic over to a new team if this flops. They really promoted the “we want a five star” product thing this time.

I have no idea how you pull off 3D Sonic, but I’ve seen some promising fan projects.
 
I don't think it's hyperbolic. As of this moment, the game looks terrible. There wasn't a single thing about it that impressed me, I actually disliked pretty much everything about it and I can't say there was a single thing I thought looked good. That may all change soon, but I have never seen a game look this bad so close to release and end up being good.
That just means it's not your cup of tea which is fine.

Even I admit the animations are rough and the world looks like it needs filling up but the concept idea here interests me a tonne.

You may have posted before but what didn't you like about it?
 
I think my issue is that even if the common points of criticism (world too empty, animations seemingly unfished, egregious pop-in, etc) were remedied to a point that's satisfactory to most, I still wouldn't be happy with Frontiers. I just never wanted open world Sonic, I fundamentally do not like the concept... I also think the music, sound effects, and visuals all lack an exciting *POP* that I've come to expect and want from Sonic games, but that's another discussion entirely.

With that being said, I DO think they could fix this up to a level that pleases most people who don't have my hang-ups if they delayed it yet another year with all the common criticisms in mind.

They never really manage to achieve good level design w/ their 3D titles
I tend to think the level design in the Adventure games, Unleashed, and Generations was absolutely phenomenal. I honestly think Final Rush is one of the greatest levels ever put into a video game.
 
This game, compared to those does not look that bad.

Rough around the edges yes but do you categorically know what build this is? Also you say developer let's not tar the team with the same brush as the suits who make the call to show this.

I agree it's unpolished and they should have handled this differently but people acting like it's the worst thing ever need to get some perspective.

The ideas look good and I hope they do what is required to bring this up to scratch.

Also you've gone from saying generically terrible to bland and uninteresting. That's your view on it but that doesn't quantify terrible in my mind. I want to see the finished article before passing judgement.
People always bring up wanting to wait to see the final product. I've yet to see a game make any significant improvement from the first gameplay demo to release. It just looks like Sonic Team sat down at the table, tried to think of a new idea but landed on the cliché open world design. They then got some AI to create an open word, threw some rails in there, some classic springs and the sonic model (with the same animations) they used from one of there older games and called it a day. Hence why the character model and world are on different art and realism scales.
 
Looking this topic I'm having some flashbacks from Vietnam's release of S3 and resetera and videos made and so on lol.
This looks great, but I dont think what they showed is awfull. If this is a 10, what they released its a 7.5 with at least 6 months (if they dont delay it) to make it better.
 
People always bring up wanting to wait to see the final product. I've yet to see a game make any significant improvement from the first gameplay demo to release. It just looks like Sonic Team sat down at the table, tried to think of a new idea but landed on the cliché open world design. They then got some AI to create an open word, threw some rails in there, some classic springs and the sonic model (with the same animations) they used from one of there older games and called it a day. Hence why the character model and world are on different art and realism scales.
Why wouldn't you want to see the final product before making a final call on something?

Also I assume you're a developer if you know exactly how Sonic Team have set out their design brief, schedules, world building, mechanics etc. They may have lifted some from other games, sure, but we don't know that. Only that the model is from Forces.

Why wouldn't you reuse assets and refine them to save time?

As I've said, it is rough around the edges but I'm reserving final call till it is out. And I hope they do the right thing if it needs more time.
 
I don’t like the “combat.” I like the principle Sonic gameplay of running through cool obstacles, jumping on/avoiding enemies. They never really manage to achieve good level design w/ their 3D titles and this looks like a lazy way around that, pushing random floating rails and “puzzles” that slow you down. We’ll see. I think it’s time to hand Sonic over to a new team if this flops. They really promoted the “we want a five star” product thing this time.

I have no idea how you pull off 3D Sonic, but I’ve seen some promising fan projects.
I've always imagined a semi-open world similar to the first Sonic Adventure where you had open world areas with actual levels. Graphically, it would be similar to the movies and gameplay wise, a mix of the latest Spiderman games and Uncharted.

It will be a Sonic origin story. He'll be brown, Dr Robotnik will be an ally initially but working on an invention that will restore the dwindled human race at the expense of the mutated, now anthropomorphic animals that are a result of previous human experiments and now dominate a post near apocalyptic earth. This brings him into conflict with Sonic and towards the end of the game, Sonic breaks the sound barrier trying to rescue a friend and that turns him blue.
 
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Why wouldn't you want to see the final product before making a final call on something?

Also I assume you're a developer if you know exactly how Sonic Team have set out their design brief, schedules, world building, mechanics etc. They may have lifted some from other games, sure, but we don't know that. Only that the model is from Forces.

Why wouldn't you reuse assets and refine them to save time?

As I've said, it is rough around the edges but I'm reserving final call till it is out. And I hope they do the right thing if it needs more time.
I never said or implied I wouldn't want to see the final product before making a judgement call. Nor did I even make a judgement call.

And no, I'm not a developer. That would be a very poor assumption by yourself. Again, I didn't say or imply that I knew anything about their development process.
 
I haven’t played every 3D Sonic, but I’ve played a few. Generations, iirc, features middling 2D gameplay, at least compared to something like Sonic Mania. The 3D gameplay is similar to what’s come before but a little more streamlined. I’m also completely bored with replaying Green Hill Zone, etc. (even though I love Mania; just drop that from 3D Sonic). I never finished it but it didn’t feel like a high quality game, at least compared to experiences with similar Sonic titles. They happened to get rid of the horrible stuff like Knuckles collecting emeralds while the worst rap imaginable plays on loops, so they got some credit for that. I’m sure I’ll buy this. I endured Forces for my kid; at least this is something new. I’ve pretty much thought the games stink since SA2, though, so that’s just me. Colors seems ok… still need to give it more time.

Sonic Team used to make a bunch of different kinds of games, usually successfully. Prob. doesn’t work keeping them a Sonic factory, if any of the same talent is there.
 
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I never said or implied I wouldn't want to see the final product before making a judgement call. Nor did I even make a judgement call.

And no, I'm not a developer. That would be a very poor assumption by yourself. Again, I didn't say or imply that I knew anything about their development process.
Well the tone of your previous messages suggests otherwise.

And again you've made an assumption on the dev process, which if it's something I know little to nothing about I wouldn't even make that assumption.
 
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Well the tone of your previous messages suggests otherwise.

And again you've made an assumption on the dev process, which if it's something I know little to nothing about I wouldn't even make that assumption.
Again, no assumption was made. An assumption would be me saying they did or I assume. If anything, it was obvious from my tone that the point I was making was little skill and or effort went into this game. I'm happy to leave this conversation for now and refer back to it in a year or two when this game is scoring below 5/10s across the board.
 
Grrrret outta herrre!
Yeah I'm sorry Nathan but the idea of brown Sonic is deeply upsetting.
You guys being serious? You do know this is an actual thing.

 
You guys being serious? You do know this is an actual thing.

Thats lore yes.. but you simply wont have no SEGA corporate blue Sonic for the whole game.
 
I'll clarify on my own end, esp. having watched the combat gameplay: I'm not writing this game off nor do I want to it to fail, and I don't want to suggest others can't enjoy it. I think Matt's right to remind that folks are allowed to be open to and excited for a game without riding the "cynicism for cynicism's sake" train.

That said, I still just admit my expectations are very low. I want to be proven wrong, truly, but this ain't our first rodeo with "Modern" Sonic. It's indeed a hasty judgment on my part to comment on the current presentation (not final game) without seeing the HUD, fuller moveset, etc., but I think my main lack of confidence comes from the aesthetics. I just don't look at it and think "I want to spend hours playing in this environment." Maybe a sense of the story and a feel for controls will help, but this sort of brooding atmosphere in a playground of randomly assorted boost era elements ain't my thing (at least for a $60 purchase).

It may indeed well handle very well, but I just find the presentation somewhat uninspiring. It also doesn't help that Sonic Team intentionally delayed this and have suggested they expect high reviews for this title. Maybe it's an old build, but I'm just not "excited." I'm not angry, disappointed, etc.-- I just have skepticism that it'll be a must play.
 
Again, no assumption was made. An assumption would be me saying they did or I assume. If anything, it was obvious from my tone that the point I was making was little skill and or effort went into this game. I'm happy to leave this conversation for now and refer back to it in a year or two when this game is scoring below 5/10s across the board.
Little skill or effort.... I dont speak for them but im many developers would take issue with that comment.

It's like me walking into your place of work, knowing nothing about what you do, seeing a piece of work and saying 'that's easy, little effort required here'.

I'm not qualified to critique the skill gone into it because I don't do your job.

The end product, how it is presented, plays etc is fair game. But to say their game development lacks skill is just disrespectful in my book.
 
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