110 Industries & Yu Suzuki

[Spaghetti]

I think that if YsNet had to go a crowdfunded route (which I don't think will happen), they'd be better off going with a recurrent support model similar to Patreon rather than trying Kickstarter again. The blast of hype that propelled the Shenmue 3 KS just wouldn't be there and it would probably max out in the $2 - 3 million range.

Pitching instead for a few dollars a month from the dedicated fanbase I think would bring in more money over the course of development and allow them to offer a set of simple rewards that don't encounter the scope creep and confusion we saw with the Kickstarter reward tiers.

If they were to do a Kickstarter now would be the time. The Yen is incredibly weak against the Dollar and the conversion would be very favorable for a Japanese developer.

Unfortunately I don't think the Patreon model would work.

Yu said it was difficult to work on Shenmue III without a fixed budget, and funding production on a variable monthly basis would exacerbate these difficulties tenfold. It makes it difficult to hire more people or even keep the staff that you've got if your ability to pay wages can rise and fall each month.

If fans are going to play a hand in funding Shenmue IV, it'll have to be the extremely wealthy ones or those in the business with access to capital (like Sergei).

 

[Dietsoap]

If fans are going to play a hand in funding Shenmue IV, it'll have to be the extremely wealthy ones

 

[Seaman]

In solidarity with buddy Dietsoap, who also hates stayin last poster.

extremely wealthy ones or those in the business with access to capital (like Sergei).

Spoiler

 

[BruceWayne911]

I have question. Is a second Kickstarter viable? Most people who funded Shenmue 3 I think are diehards like us but this time we wouldn't have a lot of outside help from the general public. Because of Shenmue 3's poor reception. I do think YS Net should at least try the Kickstarter route because the community could raise SOMETHING together. That coupled with an outside investment could totally fund Shenmue 4. Also we don't know what YS Net got in exchange for Apple Arcade exclusivity on Air Twister. So the Kickstarter amount might be lower than before.

When I spoke to Cedric he said that the Kickstarter was always intended to be a one and done thing. We all saw the inaccurate stories from the media around it and also the communication issues around it.

I'd be very surprised if they did one for Shenmue 4. The media would eat it alive for starters. I can see the headlines now: "Yu Suzuki wants more money" , "Scam game wants more funds". I'm sure there would be plenty along those lines.

Only way Kickstarter would be a viable option is for Shenmue 5. I believe emphasis on Shenmue 5 being the last game would make a Kickstarter campaign successful. Honestly I think it would be even more successful than Shenmue 3 Kickstarter. The industry wants Yu to make it to the promise land and being one game away would incentivize everyone.

 

[WuyingRen]

Only way Kickstarter would be a viable option is for Shenmue 5. I believe emphasis on Shenmue 5 being the last game would make a Kickstarter campaign successful. Honestly I think it would be even more successful than Shenmue 3 Kickstarter. The industry wants Yu to make it to the promise land and being one game away would incentivize everyone.

What if Yu decided to make Shenmue 4 the last game? Do you think that would still work or is your prediction reliant on there having been a “good” Shenmue 4 to make the final game desirable?

 

[Tosh]

I think Kickstarter could still work as like a support method, basically to get at least something
from the hardcore fans upfront. Maybe even as a proof that there still are people left
who would love to support the project.
But if the next project is still around the 10-20 mil USD budget mark,
a new Kickstarter campaign is not going to hit that mark.
We all know that the S3 Kickstarter campaign already wasnt really enough
to work without restrictions and that was already with the help of a big Sony main stage surprise
and everything. It will be basically impossible to get so many people in this train again now.
We already had the best Kickstarter hype campaign possible.

So maybe instead of 7 mil USD or whatever its gonna reach like 300.000 - 1.5 mil
and thats simply not enough for anything, at least not some voiced 3D open world game.
If they want to make it the real deal, there needs to be another publisher
with a budget boost, theres no way around that.
Even if some private multi millionaire is fine with giving away 2 mil or something, its still not enough.
With 4, 5, 6 mil they would have no other choice then downgrading absolutely everything.
No new Kickstarter campaign is going to reach that or even higher numbers.
So whats left is a new publisher who believes in the studio
or it has to be funded by multiple private investors to make it like a
digital only Ys Net self published project.
I think this whole 'the fans are going to manage this' path is a dead end now.
And not because we failed or anything but we already had our moment
where we threw our money at them and now its the time for someone else.

A game world in this size and with these details and characters, dialogues, cutscenes
cant go on with just the private fundings of some hardcore game fans. We need help.
Before Deep Silver came on board, Yu Suzuki said in a interview
that he doesnt know if S3 is gonna have fully voiced characters
or if the NPCs are going to have daily routines and how big the game world is going to be.
So we can imagine what a Shenmue game with less budget is going to look like.

 

[BruceWayne911]

What if Yu decided to make Shenmue 4 the last game? Do you think that would still work or is your prediction reliant on there having been a “good” Shenmue 4 to make the final game desirable?

I don’t think Shenmue 4 Kickstarter would work its to close to Shenmue 3. Shenmue 3 Kickstarter got alot of negative press. If Yu funds Shenmue 4 and then Kickstarters Shenmue 5 it will show that Yu exhausted all options for the franchise instead of begging and/or scamming for money. Not my thoughts just how many in the public saw it.

 

[WuyingRen]

I don’t think Shenmue 4 Kickstarter would work its to close to Shenmue 3. Shenmue 3 Kickstarter got alot of negative press. If Yu funds Shenmue 4 and then Kickstarters Shenmue 5 it will show that Yu exhausted all options for the franchise instead of begging and/or scamming for money. Not my thoughts just how many in the public saw it.

Sadly, I’m inclined to agree with you on that. Of course, one suspects that if Shenmue 4 is half decent, a Kickstarter probably wouldn’t be needed for a fifth game (assuming that the next Shenmue game doesn’t end up being the last).

 

[Catchanysailorshere?]

Well said. I also have the feeling that it would turn out that way.

Its really funny, that we as a gaming community are protecting that wholesome spark of the past. Sure, the parts of the media on YouTube etc. who called the production a scam or the game outdated, repetitive and dumb are very loud and the negativity is a magnet for clicks etc. especially in our current world situation,

What "current world situation"?

 

[Shmoopy]

What "current world situation"?

Correction. "Which one?"

 

[Shmoopy]

View attachment 17079

He can use his Bat Credit card

 

[Shmoopy]

Also I do think that's viable. I would happily burn like $400 on a shenmue 4 kickstarter

 

[Alex banana]

For all this doom and gloom, isn't it weird that Shenmue 4 could probably be made if the budget was just brought down a bit? And we can say with some certainty that with a standard 3 year development we could theoretically be playing it right about now. That's quite an improvement in outlook from prior to S3.

 

[red]

i don't get it. i thought shenmue 4 was going to be made with the profits from S3's sales?

 

[bcdcdude]

I still believe that Shenmue IV could be made on a smaller or similar budget to Shenmue III. Let's not forget a chunk of the budget went towards Kickstarter fees, postage for all the merch and also R&D getting used to the Unreal Engine. I live in hope.

We seem to have a lot of friends in high places who love Shenmue; we just need a co-ordinated effort!!

 

[Alex banana]

i don't get it. i thought shenmue 4 was going to be made with the profits from S3's sales?

I'm not sure if game financing works that way, or it might if by profits you mean the money the publisher made from the previous entry? I guess that would make sense if they were making the sequel, but I guess that doesn't apply here. In addition to no re-invested funds from the publisher, YS-Net probably has to put their own slice of the pie aside for more immediate worries - like rent and employee wages, in effect starting S4 with a dwindling Scrooge Mcduck vault. It might even be why they needed to make Air Twister - just to keep the doors open.

Man, running a small to medium game development studio has got to be a nightmare.

 

[Hermit]

For Shenmue 4 to happen and be a success, I think it would need a budget and quality level of developers that a game like A Plague Take: Innocence had. I look at publishers like Focus Entertainment and they aren't giving AAA budgets to dev studios to make a game. I also think it needs to be priced better than Shenmue 3. Shenmue 3 was priced terribly in my opinion. You're not going to sell a niche game well at $60, it would have probably been a lot more tempting if it had released at $40.

I think something like Game Pass on day 1 should be considered. It's guaranteed money right off the bat and get's the game into millions of players hands on day 1. If Shenmue 1,2 and 3 were also released on Game Pass before Shenmue 4's release, I think that would help too, it would require 3 to be ported to Xbox consoles first of course.

 

[Eishen]

Me everytime, I beginning to think more that perhaps the thing that can be done is a reduced proyect. A 2D rpg, or a visual novel.

Doing a full AAA Shenmue with a reduced budget is a very complicated thing, even with the advanced tecnology that we have today.
Yes, perhaps on paper, it fits well, but in practice it is something else.

If you try to do a full Shenmue with a reduced budget, at the end one should do compromises in one way or another. The story, the cinematics, the duration, etc.

But, if you do a reduced proyect like a 2D rpg or a visual novel, you can tell all the story you want without making any compromise, and I think that I would rather that, to see the end of the story told at half throttle.

Shenmue is the game that should count with the highest budget in the end due to its nature. (Full voice game, cinematic, with much freedom, etc)

Yes, in a perfect world, I would love to see a full Shenmue IV or V, but this doesn't like to be the case, besides, today audience only want games with violence, blood, easy memes, and things like that. Many don't want games with values like Shenmue any more, it's sad.

Well, that is only my opinion, I would rather know how the story was intended to end from the beginning, than nothing, or a greatly altered and reduced version.

 

[Kenzo130]

Me everytime, I beginning to think more that perhaps the thing that can be done is a reduced proyect. A 2D rpg, or a visual novel.

Doing a full AAA Shenmue with a reduced budget is a very complicated thing, even with the advanced tecnology that we have today.
Yes, perhaps on paper, it fits well, but in practice it is something else.

If you try to do a full Shenmue with a reduced budget, at the end one should do compromises in one way or another. The story, the cinematics, the duration, etc.

But, if you do a reduced proyect like a 2D rpg or a visual novel, you can tell all the story you want without making any compromise, and I think that I would rather that, to see the end of the story told at half throttle.

Shenmue is the game that should count with the highest budget in the end due to its nature. (Full voice game, cinematic, with much freedom, etc)

Yes, in a perfect world, I would love to see a full Shenmue IV or V, but this doesn't like to be the case, besides, today audience only want games with violence, blood, easy memes, and things like that. Many don't want games with values like Shenmue any more, it's sad.

Well, that is only my opinion, I would rather know how the story was intended to end from the beginning, than nothing, or a greatly altered and reduced version.

I think that “full voice acting and cinematic” are two things that are extremely expensive and should be sacrificed a bit like yakuza does (only the important moments are fully dubbed and fully animated).

 

[Eishen]

I think that “full voice acting and cinematic” are two things that are extremely expensive and should be sacrificed a bit like yakuza does (only the important moments are fully dubbed and fully animated).

Yes, the animations, the voice sync, etc. Into these things, there are many other "small" things or details that make everything more difficult and expensive. That would be other way.